Tinsley Ellis is not a blues purist and he never intended to be one. The 47-year-old is a life-long disciple of fiery old masters like Elmore James and consummate blues rockers like Johnny Winter. Ellis effortlessly blends gritty urban blues with edgy rock and roll. The road has been Ellis’ school. It has given this wandering musician his own brand of contemporary blues-rock. Born in Atlanta and raised in South Florida, Tinsley picked up the guitar as a youngster. Despite attaining regional success with the Heartfixers in the Southeast, he abandoned the group in 1987 with the goal to achieve national prosperity. Although he has had stints with premier blues labels (Alligator and Telarc) and one major (Capricorn), he hasn’t become as popular as his southern rock contemporaries like the Allman Brothers. Things may be about to change with his recent reunion with Alligator which commences with the upcoming release of his first live CD. Since leaving Alligator, he has “been on a rudderless ship”. Ellis is “So glad to be back on Alligator Records” that he feels “help has arrived.”
Tim: What’s the one thing that you associate with Canada? How do you know you are in Canada tonight?
Tinsley: “There’s actually more appreciation for southern music up here then there is where it came from. I think that has to do with the allure of being from far away. Perhaps an international thing. Canada has a rich blues history. Some great Canadian blues has occurred almost simultaneously with the United States. Just to name a few of them there is King Biscuit Boy. I recorded one of his songs, “Deaf, Dumb, Crippled and Blind” on my second Alligator album. Probably one of the greatest Caucasian bluesmen I’ve ever heard is Donnie Walsh. He’s the real thing. So there is a rich heritage here – both east and west. Jeff Healey is another of my favorites. He is very popular in Atlanta where I’m from. Everyone knows he is a great guitar player, but they overlook the great rich baritone singing style that he has got.”
Tim: I know that you strongly feel the blues needs another Stevie Ray Vaughan. Why is that?
Tinsley: “I say that in every interview. It seemed like there was a period where there was all these Stevie Ray imitators. I don’t see that as much anymore. Although it annoyed me at the time, because I go way back almost to day one with Stevie Ray, the only thing worse than a Stevie Ray imitator is the lack of them. With Stevie, we had somebody that could attract young people to the genre. Somebody that could get on rock radio. That is near impossible these days. Somebody who everybody agreed upon that this is the one. The rockers, the bluesmen, the kids, almost all the old folkies. So, it would be nice to have somebody come and lead the way again. That person has not come. Somewhere there’s a kid out there who is ready to do it again.”
Tim: What is going to happen to the blues if that doesn’t happen? Its already been 15 years since we lost Stevie.
Tinsley: “It will have to happen again because everything happens in cycles. Look at bluegrass. It was a big underground music and now bluegrass is in the forefront as part of movies and things like that. So, blues will come around again. I just hope it happens soon.”
Tim: The Beatles enticed you to music. Did you ever see them as a group or any of them individually perform?
Tinsley: “No, I never saw any of them. I only saw the Stones once. But, I was really influenced by the British Blues movement and still am. Probably my favorite was Peter Green while he was with Fleetwood Mac. He had a great style and was so tasteful. I’m just a fan of anybody that bends a guitar string in a bluesy kind of way. Albert King was the string bendingest and so, all of his disciples, I’m into. I’m just a fan. I started out as a fan, and I remain a fan. I go to all the shows that I can. I was lucky enough to see B.B. King back before he was a household word. I saw Howlin’ Wolf, Muddy Waters, Albert Collins. A lot of the greats. I was the little kid that was at the concert. Then, I was the young man who was opening the concerts and getting to sit in.”
Tim: Besides the money, what keeps you on the road 200+ nights per year?
Tinsley: “All traveling bluesmen are hams. We get hooked on the applause and the attention and the interviews and it gets in your blood. It becomes a part of what you do. We don’t play the kind of music that is on the rock radio stations. We don’t play the kind of music that gets seen on Jay Leno, David Letterman, or MTV. So, it’s real important that we take it to the people.”
Tim: Does taking it to the people help to get young kids hooked on the blues these days?
Tinsley: “There’s a lot more availability of blues records then when I was starting out. Now, the CDs have so much information on who played on the records. When you used to get a Chess record, it didn’t say who played on anything. So, as a kid you didn’t know about Hubert Sumlin, Jody Williams, and Otis Spann. Now, there is more information for the young people, and there are also instructional videos. I can remember playing as a teenager until my fingers bled trying to sound like Elmore James, until somebody told me he was using a slide.”
Tim: Are you a self taught guitarist?
Tinsley: Absolutely, and nothing but. People used to have these parties and me and my friends would go and play. We were keg party jammers. I’ve sort of stayed with that. I don’t know anything about written music, but I can name some important chords. I can recognize different styles within the blues. Some of these kids are so sharp. They know all about music theory.”
Tim: You classify yourself as a blues/rock musician. In other interviews you’ve stated “when white musicians play blues it comes out as blues/rock”. You deserve credit for saying that. Why is it that when white people play blues is comes out with a rock edge?
Tinsley: “You can put on blues satellite radio, which is a good thing that has happened, you can listen and hear a bunch of unknown people and I can pretty much tell whether they are white or black. The vocalist has a lot to do with it. They asked Muddy Waters about how he felt about young white people playing the blues and he said, ‘well they are real good, but I believe we can out vocalize them.’ There is nothing like an African-American singer. We can approximate that, and some people can hit the nail on the head like Lonnie Mack or Greg Allman. In the white tradition we go more for instrumentation and guitar solos, whereas in the old black blues, its about story telling and singing and gospel and church.”
Tim: A lot of your songs tell stories. But have you really had as many bad relationships as your songs indicate?
Tinsley: “Yes, but I’m trying to minimalize that now. On The Hard Way (his most current release until the new live CD comes out) I sing about a lot of my friends’ relationships too. I’ve had some good ones, but I’ve had some bad ones. Just like everyone else. Basically I write two types of songs: love songs and instrumentals. So there’s not a lot of singing about the woes of the world.”
Tim: How did you first hook up with Bruce Iglauer of Alligator Records 20 years ago?
Tinsley: “We used to send him our records that we made outta Atlanta when I was on the Landslide label. This was when I was in The Heartfixers, years ago. 2 or 3 records went by and finally he thought maybe I should meet this guy. So we had a nice phone conversation. I think that was in ’86. He flew to Atlanta to see us and saw us play for a hometown crowd. We realized that we had Freddie King and Elmore James and Magic Sam and Buddy Guy in common. He took me on when the Heartfixers broke up in ’87. We did 5 albums together and he re-issued 2 of the Heartfixers albums. That was during the late 80s early 90s. It was a glorious time for blues. Then, I saw stars in my eyes and got a chance to sign with a major, and invariably when that happens to a blues act bad things happen. I signed with Capricorn which was a huge label at the time, and they went out of business right after my album came out. (They were the southern rock label in the ’70s with acts like the Allman Brothers and Marshall Tucker). During their resurfacing they got all kinds of great bands that sold millions of albums like 3/11, Cake, and Widespread Panic. They were on top when they signed me. The owner, Phil Walden, maybe he saw it coming with the economy, but he sold his catalog to Metallica’s manager including my album. That man promptly asked ‘what is a Tinsley Ellis’? So, that was the end of that. Next, it was off to Telarc. I like the Telarc albums. I had higher hopes and I think they did too. But, they allowed me to make my own records the way I wanted to make them. I wrote all the songs. I even produced. It was a learning experience. We do a lot of those songs live, in fact, 3 of the songs I recorded for Telarc are going to be on my new live album.”
Tim: How did Derek Trucks (current guitarist with the Allman Brothers) and Chuck Leavell (piano player for Eric Clapton, Rolling Stones among many others) end up on Storm Warning?
Tinsley: “Derek was coming out to our shows when he was 11 or 12 years old. He was sitting in with us and is just a phenom on guitar. He was 14 years old when he guested on Storm Warning. The kid was great then, and he is unbelievable now. Chuck I had already recorded together on the Trouble Time CD. He is just a great all-around utility piano/organ guy. He studied under Dr. John. He played one of the all-time greatest piano solos on the Allman Brothers “Jessica” song. He was a teenager when he played that. He was the Allman Brothers original teenager. The boy wonder we called him.”
Tim: Was it like déjà vu when you first were getting to know Derek?
Tinsley: “Yes and no. When I was 14 years old I was terrible. I’m always nice to the really young guitar players because you never know when one of them is going to turn into the next Derek Trucks or Johny Lang.”
Tim: How did you come full circle and end up back on Alligator?
Tinsley: “Alligator is the premier blues label. They know every nook and cranny worldwide which is something the majors don’t know. Alligator knows how to market this type of music as a grassroots music and not as a “lets make a video and throw a bunch of money at it” type of thing. That never works for roots music. I re-connected with Bruce although we have always been in business because we have all these albums together. Initially, we started talking about how to revive my Storm Warning CD which is by far the biggest selling CD I ever had. One thing led to another and I told him I wanted to make a live album. The whole thing happened so quickly. Within 4 months of talking about it, we have the record in the can now. We made it in April in Chicago and it will be out in June.”
Tim: It was recorded at Chord On Blues. How was that venue selected?
Tinsley: “It’s a great sounding room. It’s almost like a small theater. People came from 12 different States and Canada to come see us make a live album. Very user friendly atmosphere as opposed to something more downtown which the logistics are more difficult. It worked out really good.”
Tim: Where any special recording techniques used?
Tinsley: “It was recorded over 2 nights. We used the Metromobile recording truck that did all the Alligator albums I like so much – the Lonnie Mack, Lonnie Brooks, Luther Allison. They are the mobile recording unit in Chicago. So, that figured into the venue location a lot. Also, by doing that I was able to utilize the Alligator connections. They really got the word out. The new live CD is the longest I ever made. You couldn’t fit another minute of music on to the disc. It’s like 79 minutes. “
Tim: You’ve worked with legendary producers like Tom Dowd (Allman Brothers, Eric Clapton), David Z (Johny Lang, Prince), and Eddy Offord (Yes, ELP). What did you learn from producers of that caliber?
Tinsley: “Each of them brought to the table something different. Offord was a progressive British rock guy. I made 4 or 5 albums with him going way back. Offord was the best engineer of the bunch. David Z was the best vocal coach. I learned more about vocals with David Z than any other producer. Tom was the best arranger and repertoire person I ever worked with. He was just a wizard with the songs. In future, I’m going to try and produce as much stuff as I can because the audience doesn’t know the big name producers and that doesn’t sell records. What sells records is excitement and being who you are. When we did the live album, that’s what Bruce and I wanted to do – to show me in my element which is in the night clubs doing my music. 3 or 4 of the songs are 10 minutes or longer. There is no lets fade out here and try and get it on the radio – none of that. It’s the first album I’ve ever made where we didn’t even talk about radio. It was as if it didn’t exist which it pretty much doesn’t for me. I’m betting on the fact that people still like long jam songs. I’m betting that there is a larger audience for that then the industry says there is.”
Tim: Does the track listing on the live album span your entire career?
Tinsley: “We went back and forth on the wish list. We also put something on my website about sending song requests. For the most part those requests happened to mirror the songs I chose anyway. The fans did come up with a few that I wouldn’t have picked. We did a lot of songs from the Storm Warning era because that’s what the fans wanted. The majority of my fans just wanted me to make the Storm Warning album over again in front of an audience. So we kinda did. There are 3 or 4 from Storm Warning on the new live album.
Tim: The Telarc releases have a refined and seasoned sound. Was that something you were specifically going after or was it just a result of being a more mature musician?
Tinsley: Basically on Telarc I was able to do all the stuff that Bruce Iglauer wouldn’t let me do. Which is come to grips with my inner James Taylor. There is that side of me. The new live CD doesn’t have any of that side of me on it. It just flat rocks. If sales are the gauge of what I should be doing then Bruce Iglauer wins.”
Tim: Why are you not as popular as your southern rock counterparts?
Tinsley: “There is a need for my work to remain confidential. An artistic need. That may sound like a joke and it kind of is. But, bad things happen to blues artists that have a hit song. I would love to have one, but bad things happen, think about it. Because you are chasing the hit. I have no hit to chase. Son Seals once told me, ‘you can make a pretty good dollar as a blues musician if you are willing to carry your own amp. Think about that too”.
Later that evening at a club in Windsor, Ontario, Ellis performed his blues-based rock which was mean, tough, bold, loud and excessive. It regularly crossed over into the hard rock arena, and the crowd loved every moment of it. His backing band where a bunch of rock and roll animals. They included a pit bull drummer, energy-crazed keyboardist, and a ready to kill bass player. Together, they had more tattoos than a bunch of young ladies on a Mexican beach! If this scorching biker blues performance is anything like the new live CD, it is going to be a killer.
For additional information about Tinsley Ellis and Alligator Records, contact: www.tinsleyellis.com and www.alligator.com
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